Sounds like you've been scarred by it.

I just think the math doesn't work. That's why Deliveroo is getting into delivering trainers and Screwfix products because they don't have the overall loaded costs of everything else. They just have the rider logistics model, which is brilliant. It's their asset, a great piece of machinery. They'd rather charge per delivery order to another player and make pure profit. I'll give you an example. KFC, global commission fee, 20 odd percent, £15 average order value. You're making £3, right? It's costing you £4 to send the rider.

It's actually that low as an average order value for KFC?

However, the reality is that the lifetime value doesn't exist. You might think a customer will buy from Wagamama and then move on to higher-end Indian restaurants, spending more money, but they don't. They're a KFC customer, spending £15 for their bucket and Coke, and that's it. They don't become profitable customers, leading to diminishing returns through these channels. All of them do it, and the McDonald's contracts are a joke. Those contracts don't make any money.

What percentage of Deliveroo's business comes from those big QSR brands?

I'm trying to recall. Back in the day, it was about 20% to 30% that came from the big restaurants.